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The Value of Parenting Plan: Do you have one? How is it working?

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not me it scary all right I think we're live welcome everybody welcome to this massive crowd here at the at the Lion's Den is that what we call it nickel difficulties WIC online thanks for joining us I want to share just some ideas on things we want to talk about in the future and then we'll get to all we want talk about today so buddy and I have been married 27 years and we've just raised two kids I think we're price still raising them but they're both out of the house and we're empty nesting and so we have to, student right here in Lubbock we love them we love it that they have their own housing and so parenting and raising a family but sending them out and letting them accomplish what they need to is a privilege as well so we're really grateful that our kids were raised in a private school in Lubbock spent OnStaff I actually went fourth fifth sixth and seventh grade Aaron's assistant first season back in the day and so all that translates into so we were gone for 18 years just came back this summer and so we did raise our kids in a private school as well and cool as the enemy we see it as family we're A House Divided okay so anyway that's a little bit about us and so some things that we were just brainstorming some ideas some future topics I want to talk about who knows when we'll get to him but please I want to talk about down the road is the greatest challenge of our first decade of marriage Funtime chica holstex nuts all on navigating sexual ethics and intimacy that's not today another topic would be the greatest challenge of our second decade of marriage that would be parenting philosophy and implementation we are diving into a little bit of that today another topic that would be fun as the greatest challenge of our third decade of marriage and that is sports parenting so having been race kids through Private School athletics there's a whole lot of Salvation that needs to happen in the private school athletic world do some ideas out there on the value of a parenting plan and this is just our take on this just to people's perspective at times differing perspectives probably on this topic but parenting is interesting because I think sunsets have been in the church forever you could probably write the book on parenting but what I've discovered on parenting is that it's not as clear as we probably wanted to be there some general ideas but where do we really go script wait until this is what you do in this situation I just don't see it there personally and I've been walking with God for a while read the Bible regularly and there's this not this clear manual on how other than we know that we should be doing something with that and that's why I think this topic is pretty fascinating I will say as I mentioned a moment ago this was the second greatest challenge in our marriage was parents and that's what two people in theory we're on the same page philosophically but we would have. It very differently and how that works out I impacted our marriage and civil price share a little bit of that blood and guts throughout the course of this time today come on in we're close together and in a perfect world would rather just be conversation because we're recording live online it'll probably be a little bit more us talking then why would we prefer and opportunities around the table with your friends with your family happy to connect with you and however I love you first let me do this disclaimer we are not perfect parents in fact of our kids were here to do this with us they would very pretty quickly jump in and go see Battle Scars got a joke in our home for a long time that we said that we would help our kids through college or we could take some of their college fund and use it to pay for counseling for the trauma that we put them through and there's probably the truth on both sides of that clearly things that we have failed miserably at there's a few things we but man we are not experts by any means but because we have been in Ministry for a long time we've talked to other family so we know tell me about other people wrestle with some of these things as well and he's notes at some point we will but Deuteronomy 6 so we have a post these notes but I don't want to rehash all this but if you brought her ideas to drive me six obvious we get this idea that we're to love God with all your heart soul mind and strength and that we are to follow those commands and number to repeat them to our children so where did there's a there's a clear biblical precedent they were diverted cheats to our children the principles of God we're supposed to have says talk about them when you're at home when you're on the road when you going to bed when you getting up so there's this idea important to our kids things of God that's clear and scripture but what are we teaching them how do we do that how does your family do that how do we do that I think there's probably a ton of flexibility in that big Ideas Joshua scripture mind as for me and my house Joshua says we will serve the Lord okay what does that look like for your family to serve the Lord how how each of our family serve the Lord that probably has different expressions in the same way that our marriage is probably look little bit different but at the end of the day does your house serve the one so get cool principal but broad principle what's that really mean do you have to have quiet time is everyday a joke about in our marriage that you know we know people that really love doing couples devotionals together I'm talking like a marriage devotional book him and that works for a lot of people neither of us are really devotional kind of people what when we had a great idea we were on your Bible together we were going to redo the chronological One Year Bible and so we you know January 1st we pull out I lay on the bed you know on her stomach sore reading the Bible and you know we start going and it's time to turn the page and I'm not come on dude like Turn the Page and he's like not there yet so we're kind of you know having some reading differences and then we're trying to keep going and then he's like okay this is not working for me you read too fast and then I'm going okay let's read it out loud will that works for about 30 seconds so January 2nd we had two bottles we were reading the same one your Bible and we were reading the same thing but we did not have to do it together what that did though is it just showed us you know part of our personalities but then it enabled us to by no means that every day that we talked about you know what what did God reveal to you today but it was it was the discipline it was the accountability and then it was you know also you knew that he was reading the same thing so if you had thought questions you know God did show you something it was a good opportunity to to share that together as on the same page but it was much more pleasant with two bottles someone to do that having a conversation about that is there a clear play I want spiritual leadership like that's another topic another day but that's a really great example there's a lot of ways to grow spiritually but how we do it how you do it how your family doesn't there's a ton of flexibility and so but are we doing that train up a child in the way they should go when they're all they will not depart from it really powerful verse we've all clung to that at different times and seasons and by the way we just say this one thing about it there have been seasons in our parenting I'll speak for me not for Bonnie there going to season in our parenting our kids you know this by the way so they happen to be watching which I guarantee you they're not have been seasons of parenting where I didn't like my kids and mortally at different times there is supposed to take care of them they share my last name but I really can't stand this kid right now and they probably can't stand me and fortunately those hit different seasons has been times and seasons in and likewise our kids were here I can assure you they would also share that Dave had seasons were they couldn't stand us now they really liked our money and our food right now and so that's helpful but we just go to those Seasons but how do we train a child in the way they should go again there Sprite rig flexibility and latitude on how we do that but we are to do that about whoever spares the rod of discipline your kid but if you love your kids if we love our kids week are enough to discipline them but what does that look like Josh we all discipline differently you and I discipline differently and so how do we do all that season 6 fathers don't provoke your children to anger don't exasperate them but bring them up in the instruction and disappoint the Lord so we have broad principles but I'm saying today when your kids to get something and they call you going can you bring me my lunch when they lose that expensive pair of basketball shoes you just bought them for the season and they left them in the gym where's that in the book where is that in the by how you going to navigate that don't have those kinds of things and so I find the Bible to be pretty brought in that sense and what I think that means for us as there's a lot of flexibility but at the end of the day do we have a plan exercise for a second there if we are going to exercise you'll see quickly that we're wired very different if we're going to exercise and we went to the gym which we are now going this is a brand-new season in our marriage 27 years later we're actually going to the gym together okay dang it let's go one of us is really clotty literally wakes up every Dave crane I'm going to stay in bed today. Let me clarify I'll told her she doesn't have to go work out that's her choice she feels guilty I can't help that there's gasoline available for that but I'm going to go exercise I'm going to go actually myself but if we're going to the gym all of us in this room those via line we would all probably go do it differently most people would tell us right exercise we need to do some cardio to do some resistance to be healthy and general going to take care of her heart and resistances is healthy and in part of that mix now we're going to get that cardio treadmill elliptical the exercise bike the row machine there's so many people just go outside and put their there's a lot of ways to put at the end of the day we're trying to get cardio in resistance the same way so we're going to pick different ways to do it and are parenting our spiritual life is much like that was talked about her spiritual life for just a second before we get the parenting is parenting tips in the world we can have we could give couple greatest marriage tips in the world they're worthless if husband and wife are not walking with God I'm just it doesn't work we've met with couples weekly for decades and I've never met a couple yet that came in who were both spending time with God and had massive issues 100% of time one or both of them are not spending time with God so I think parenting is the same idea if mom and dad are not spending time with God go right to book on parenting you're going to fail miserably because of the spirit of God is not in you one of those practical things matter the flash will so our time we got it we're going to get healthy spiritually it's going to involve time in the work and prayer at some level now how we all do that again great differences in how we get into the word the One Year Bible reading through a book of the Bible where can do a devotional working through a study book I mean there's a million ways to get the word there's a lot of different ways to incorporate prayer now let's take it to Parenting Pride two key pieces of parenting again total opinion we both turned him down to two things that's probably two sides of the same coin and that is this is that parenting really boils down to what is as discipline there's a discipline piece of parenting and then there's a discipleship piece of parenting they are totally different issues two sides of the same coin to discipline I when I say this when I'm going to call that the Practical everyday this is the Practical side of how we bring correction all that kind of stuff how we make those daily decisions but discipleship is totally different than that how do we train our kids to love God pursue God those are different issues but they're all part of the parenting process is Hillary going to dive into those a little bit today and just some ideas on those two sides but we all tend to do better with a plan Bonnie's plan is at Mid gets up and flips a light on that means dang it we got to go to the gym that's her plan my plan is I just know I'm supposed to exercise by the way I don't enjoy it I've never had a high exercise High I've never experienced the joy of working out I'm just going to do it because I'm supposed to do it cancel my favorite part of the day as walking out of the gym every morning cuz the best part of my day but we're just going to do that but here's why the plan helps because it provides the foundation for consistency and so when we talk parenting if you have a plan it'll allow for some consistency in the Home Pleasant here's what the experts say about parenting they say that you can take a parent I was just say that I'm the realest Rick of the word type is all hypothetical what does a Honda Super strict really drill sergeant type parent and you're the super kind graceful friend be best friends with my kid, radical extremes of parenting the experts say this about that they say our kids are smart enough to adapt to both styles of parenting they will manipulate us but as long as there's consistency our kids can sign their way through all that what'll really Jack our kids is the real inconsistency we were changing our philosophy all the time we're changing how we do things some days I'm nice some days I mean the kids can handle it no matter how extreme we are on the spectrum of parenting they can adapt if there's some consistently having some type of plan Building it doesn't it brings Clarity and conflict when our kids make us so mad we're ready to absolutely lose her mind and we're going to make really are rational bad decisions when we lived cheat on how we're going to parent it bring stability when we're ready to blow our top and just it's an anchor Point what I want to do right now in this situation is this but we've agreed into this and it helps us process and manage that emotional tension tropical part of parenting we talked about having a plan and a green I'm at these are the kinds of things that were talking about I'll give you some resources and ideas in a moment but early childhood all the way through seniors in high school and by the way if her parents watching this your kids are in high school and Gomez really too late we kind of already messed them up and we've done this and we've done that there's what's crazy is our practical little tools and principles you could go Implement tonight that would immediately change your home and it's not too late it's possible again kids are adaptable and once they see us start changing. This is very doable. it's never really too late it's not even too late with adult children in that sense but do stay back to young kids you know at some point you had to establish are we going to spank or not there was a generation about the question we just we spank our kids we discipline our kids you know there was a day in schools that spanking think even when you were still on staff here at Trinity I was coming to call Mom and Dad up to the office I don't know which one new so I don't know where that's at but in today's culture that's probably not super acceptable it's not super great week we are actually out of town this weekend as our little discipline back in the day but it was not just any old I mean it was like I mean it was like if I broke it on our kids I would probably go to jail I mean like it was a solid red the Hi-Lo Define specialty kitchen store I mean it and it was a hundred percent Maple so we we named her Maple lemon that was her name where was this back in the day why does so good so I'm not saying that that's what you should or shouldn't do but I'm saying that as a Mom and Daddy got to decide what you're doing with that are we doing that or we're not doing that why are we doing or not doing that you and you need to know those things all right so that's progress all right now screen time screen time used to be more teenage and above now screen time really is irrelevant conversation for are toddlers right what are you going to do with screen time incredible resources at attorneys brought in recently on these kinds of conversation great resources are available cell phones cell phone conversations Mom and Dad have got to talk about you going to have to figure out what you going to do with what's your family are you guys going to be a part of the local church is your kid going to be involved in the youth group what are those expectations why are you doing those are you pulling those kids into those conversations how are they involved in all that what about dating was talking about dating you know we grew up in a generation where the book was called I Kissed Dating Goodbye real popular great little Condor some really cool Concepts in the book we actually made our kids read that book in junior high my son's a little kid and so he couldn't get past the title he saw it does the book was called I kissed him a guy goodbye that was the rule in our house that we don't date that's not what we were saying we said we're not dating until you've read this book and we've had this conversation and we come to some agreement together the daughter was wired a little differently she wasn't convicted by the title she was dating behind the scenes unbeknownst to us and we just thought we were in control right and so extreme drive but but what how do you get mom and dad with Mom and Dad got to get on the same page on what that looks like what you going to do with the first car when I turn 16 are they getting driver's license all these decisions inscription go okay please and 6 says the kid gets a new car when I turn 16 it's not there and so you can have to figure these things out what's your philosophy on discipline side yes we're going discipline our kids but how are we going to do that so there's great resources what time are you a helicopter type parent do you hover protect tell him what to do in our experience and youth ministry and parenting and Ministry we've seen kids come from all of those environments by the way and they can all do fine racing kids come from really strict homes. really rebellious we've seen kids come home from from realistic homes and they were very obedient and compliant and love God again I don't think that those things are the ultimate goal however we do think it's valuable to talk about those things and they're probably pros and cons if you're super strict this is a bad idea we borrowed from some people that really influenced us early in our parenting but we don't what are 16 year old making their first decision in the backseat of a car I think about that if that's their first decision we've not set them up for success so how you going to navigate that how do we equip our kids to make those Chi decisions decisions price start having a lot earlier age and it has to do with our parenting style our parenting philosophy and so there's a whole lot of conversation going on what do we think about these things so it's overwhelming right is overwhelming there's so many things going on our culture has changed so much technology thing right here cuz I could do one thing differently I would love to raise kids that would be my dream because this was a game-changer but it is reality that's the world we all live in now so whether we like it or not back to everybody has a phone and let's change the way we do things and so that has influenced how we parent kids and it's overwhelming in it requires a whole new level of how we do it and so what's the preferred parenting Style they all work honestly our preference I think our preference if we were picking I'm probably more naturally a drill sergeant what was he wouldn't think you're more natural I'm a drill sergeant with helicopter to music I am a dress I mean in our parenting Styles I was I was home with them all day which was always my excuse of why I would blow my top quicker you know he comes home and kid throws something off at the high chair and and I lose it and he's like they threw a Cheerio off the hutch and unlike do you know how many times I've done that today do you know how many times I've told him not to do that in so let me know it was you know again it was my excuse why I blew my top but I grew up in a verbal louder home then him and I didn't like that I held and I didn't want to yell but I yell a lot and it would I mean it was nothing for me to do. Talking like they should not be knocking in modeling all the bad things but it was an issue challenging when you do it when we agreed on a philosophy that our implementation was different which sometimes made it harder in some ways because he's like you say you want to do this but you don't and that God created That's Where It's At or detention came between us because I really did want to I really do want to work out but I really don't want him to wake up everyday and turn the light on. it's kind of that same tug-of-war of agreeing on the philosophy and agreeing on how we want to do it but our implementation was different would probably in all I was a drill sergeant I'm probably more the I'm praying more helicopter now than I was them or relational to it so it's not like they can figure it out but it creates a lot of internal stress for us cuz I want to be this way but I'm that way I was to the dad that good cry over spilled milk I can handle a lot of things but there's a little stuff that would chew on me and we just had differences like that and so it was just very challenging but let me tell you what happened for us when our kids we move to the northwest or kids are very young and we moved across the street from a family that was a part of our church but they also started a Christian High School and until we got to know them and their High School and we watch this family and we were just getting to know them and we were driving to Chuck-E-Cheese we were taking our kids to Chuck-E-Cheese but their middle school kids I wanted to come with us so we're driving to Chuck-E-Cheese and we're just trying to get to know these kids and they're really sharp middle school kids and we're driving in a little Minivan and I said hey what do you love about your parents I said hey what's something you love about your mom and dad and something that they've done great and these two middle school kids without hesitation responded this way they said we love it that our parents put boundaries on us about ran off the road like it blew me away they could have said Anythink there was no rehearsal for this two middle school kids said they love their parents put boundaries on them all I'm saying is that captured our attention and so we began to watch do parenting how do you raise kids like this and then what and I walked over and handed us a buck what you do you love people that are struggling on us and they handle this is booked and they said hey this is a resource we think could really help you guys and we knew we were spanking too much in our home we would just get mad kind of like varying phases I mean like varying stages of you know how many how many spankings is this offense and how many in you know I can get it all confused you know he can't even remember it and I knew that we were an effective one day when Carter was like his automatic and I was like what do you mean is that an automatic and he's a cool some things are automatically five and this is automatically this and I'm like we're missing the point here is it an automatic so they introduce it to a little resource in a tent how to say this word clearly we think this is the only resource even the best resource it's a resource but they introduced us to a book called love and logic would never heard of it I did what it was we just knew we liked what we saw in their home and their kids and they were at the Gators and so they had influence in our lives and so we read this little book on Love & Logic the principles really simple the big idea is we give away as much freedom and choice are kids as possible as early as often as possible and when we need to say no we reserve the right to say no but because giving them so much empowerment and decision-making what we need to manage that we do it in any time that they put themselves or anyone else in danger we obviously get involved but it's really about learning and teaching the kids to take possibility and live with the natural consequence at the big idea of the principles in this particular parenting philosophies are super simple the crazy hard to implement crazy hard to implement and so when like we're not going to our kids wearing a coat out in the cold weather that's not really an option but we might say would you like to wear your coat out the door or put it on when you get to school when we give kids two choices that we okay where is it crazy how that takes the fight out of it and that you know there's other super popular I don't know how influential that is now love and logic is more was real strong in the Northwest and in other parts of the country the biggest Growing Kids God's way was just that our kids shouldn't be the center of your universe and that was just even just that one little principal is an example of me I didn't do every single thing that we haven't done every single thing that any book read in any book says we'll talk about that when we would kind of pool ideas and and hey let's try this and let's try this again and but that was that was the biggest principle I don't can't tell you much other than you know from going to Skyway bathroom the easels at the symbol for Isis is kids RN Edition our family not the focus that's a powerful principle not everybody buys any of that but that's why I empty nesting so awesome right now because we didn't build our lives around our kids know their lies control our world for a lot of years but it's not built and so that was a principal we borrowed from that idea so 11 logic provided super helpful framework for us they are Christian by the way if so you buy these books you won't find scriptures in them but they are believers in them a lot of reason they don't do that because they're in a lot of public schools and a huge part of their philosophy is getting into the school system but the love and logic approach was easier for me to embrace and Implement them for Bonnie what body style is really important to she was also with them all day while I was at work those are all factors that affect how we do parenting we're wired differently our personalities are different and so all of those things factored in but I will say has weed so we agreed philosophically on how we were going to raise her kids but this was also the greatest conflict in our marriage for a few year never X I could not stand by she knows app she's not been able to end the greatest issue I had was watching how she would speak to our kids of times back to the yell and I was just shut me down I would be so angry at her and it was so difficult and I didn't know how to I didn't know how to fix it and she didn't want to be that way but she didn't know what to do with it tell me we were a mess and it was conflict and we're trying to figure out in my life is just crazy hard but don't let anybody kids you I remember before we had kids we were doing youth Minister here and I remember reading the James Dobson book who's going way back you have to have real gray hair to know James Dobson probably but James Dobson remember reading a book bring that boys and it's somewhere lucky man he brings up this idea and goes you know parenting teens you just try to survive but that was supposed to be idea of what he was saying I remember reading that it's just why does he say that and then we had teenagers and all the sudden dr. Austin was a whole lot smarter how we do this try to survive this maybe we do just hang out in fact we joke with our son now that if we didn't know how much he was going to thrive on Independence we would have moving out at 8:12 where does putting on his own at 12 at a life would have been good for everybody right challenging these were crazy hard times for us but I went to 11 lots of conference and I sat down with the authors of this material and I told them the struggle that buying our having and listen to what he said who's the author of the material he would make prices like that's fine you keep acting like that I'm going to be in a better nursing home than you are yeah and that's that's not original I stole that from lava people that joke about that n**** listen you know you can parent however you want to just remember your kids will be picking your assisted living home today so keep that in myself we would joke about that a little bit okay so we might have had some cheap meal away but I did mention this was a really hard time for us right crazy difficult tension and there was a season as like Man Poor bonds going to be on Mexican to be taken care of advice going to come in to see Mick and I never season you're going to have to hire your own health care because I got to be with Bond and we don't want to buy the house like that we don't want to press it like that but your father's in the book said this is what the love of lots of guy said he said listen he goes don't lose your marriage over parenting philosophy he said listen there's a lot of great stuff out there borrow what you like from us grab these principles from this Source over here cut and paste adapt borrow what you like if it's more natural for you great if it's not natural don't calendar about it don't try to fix her don't try to correct just let it go because your kids are resilient and it took the authors of this material and I went home and I had to literally come home and apologize to Bonnie I'm wrong I've been holding you to this I've been wanting you to do this like I do it and then I disagree on this because there was some X Bonnie this is this is two sides of the story I'll give her a chance to refute this in a moment but there were times I felt like she was so demoralizing and degrading to our kids I could care less what anybody said in front of kids because that was not okay that was my perspective is right and he's right at my hardest part was I would I would be one way in public sometimes and and I mean honestly wasn't in a performance way it was just you know I was nicer and you know I would never talk to your kids the way I talk to my kids I would never talk to other kids away but I can't read mine and then you know come back and apologize I was always quick to ask for forgiveness and to apologize and all those things which I mean those are huge the same as they're very cute but no I mean you were right there were definitely times I think that was his biggest tension you wouldn't treat anyone else the way that you that you think it's okay and it wasn't that I thought it was okay I literally didn't know what to do I could get to that point I just had a longer fuse and then I could hit a point where I would equally blow up and are kids in the process to and then once I'm there I could care less like great I want them shredded right now like in our flesh we just were going to do that which is bad spiritual relationship and grow and there's Grace God gives us Grace disgrace so all I have to say that was just the resource that helped us we know people that really were drunk with kids God's way people we know people that were really in the shepherding a child's heart I don't even know what the latest parenting the priority great new resources we just don't know about the point is freezing its Bible to get a plan to agree philosophically on how you want to do it in general and then borrow cut and paste into what works for you and your home we like 7 until one day I picked up from Shepherd and child's heart was the emphasis on sin but aren't the way we do life and how we function we don't walk around until our kids without sin that is not how we talk that's not how we do things and so is everything wasn't our primary lame but it did make me think about we may probably need to talk about this more than we are and so there was some

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